Converting from 4e

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DM Cojo
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Converting from 4e

Post by DM Cojo »

I just got my holiday grab bag, big box o' stuff. It had a lot of cool items. Several of the modules I was sent are for 4e rules. I have never played 4e, so I really don't know much about the system. How easy do you think these would be to convert to DCC RPG? And what kind of things would I have to do to use them that way?
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Skyscraper
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Re: Converting from 4e

Post by Skyscraper »

DM Cojo wrote:I just got my holiday grab bag, big box o' stuff. It had a lot of cool items. Several of the modules I was sent are for 4e rules. I have never played 4e, so I really don't know much about the system. How easy do you think these would be to convert to DCC RPG? And what kind of things would I have to do to use them that way?
I've played a bit of 4E (well, quite a bit), and direct usage of 4E stuff will not work in DCC; however the general principle remains the same, i.e. they're both d20 rulesets. It will make direct conversion difficult, but not unthinkable in my opinion.

Here are a few things you should know of 4E that would make the transition a bit bumpy, in nor particular order:

- the ACs in 4E increase steadily over the levels
- the HPs in 4E start very high (e.g. a lowly goblin has 30 hit points) and some monsters have hundreds of hits points at higher levels
- the damage in 4E is correspondingly much more important. Some first level monsters can deal 15 or 20 damage with their basic attack.
- there are no saving throws, the REFL, WILL and FORT are "defenses" with target values like AC. Attacks consequently target either one of the AC, WILL, FORT, REFL defenses.
- there are no spells, really (see below)
- non spell-casting classes all have special powers
- all characters (PC and NPCs) have "powers" that deal some damage and, in most cases, have a limited effect associated to them. For example the spell "thunder burst" will deal some damage and push creatures of up to 10 feet to all creatures within a 30x30 feet adjacent area next to the caster. Most spellcasters (i.e. wizards, ...) usually have powers that affect an area of effect (usually small-sized), but many non-spellcasters also have powers that affect an area of effect (usually small sized also) such that both spell caster and non-spell caster essentially have the same result in-game, although explained differently. For example, the fighter might have a "sweeping strike" attack that deals 1d10 + 5 damage to anyone adjacent to him, and the wizard might have a "ring of fire" spell that deals 1d10 + 5 fire damage to anyone adjacent to him.
- 4E modules that I've seen comprise tons of battles, with predefined battle maps often being proposed where creature positioning is pre-set. I don't think that this is the DCC spirit, but if you like tactical combat, you might find this to your liking.
- battles in 4E usually include many opponents pitted against the PCs. In DCC, I suspect that the result might be that the PCs would probably die over a number of battles if not in a single one.

If you feel comfortable to wing it as your players advance in the 4E modules by more or less inventing stats based on your understanding of a monster's flavor, or work in advance to translate at least the hit points and damage and defenses, perhaps it might work. I would suggest reducing the number of monsters and the number of battles, to make adventuring through the different areas a bit more oriented on something else that combat. I would also consider preparing spells for the important spell casters, that would be different than the low-key 4E spell powers.

One fun aspect of 4E is the special powers that the different monsters have. For example, the dumb hill giant might have a "powerful strike" attack that "pushes and makes prone" opponents hit by that attack, in addition to the damage. This is of course suggestive that someone hit by the hill giant will fly through the air to land further away. I think something like that can be very cool to use in any system, including DCC, to add flavor and show how strong that opponent is. I think that if you use a 4E module, your players are likely to find that fighting the monsters is never boring and they usually have something to distinguish them from the others, as every single monster has one or more specific power.

Feel free to ask specific questions if you have any.
Maledict Brothbreath, level 4 warrior, STR 16 (+2) AGI 7 (-1) STA 12 PER 9 INT 10 LUCK 15 (+1), AC: 16 Refl: +1 Fort: +2 Will: +1; lawful; Armor of the Lion and Lily's Blade.

Brother Sufferus, level 4 cleric, STR 13 (+1) AGI 15 (+1) STA 11 PER 13 (+1) INT 10 LUCK 9, AC: 11 (13 if wounded, 15 if down to half hit points), Refl: +3 Fort: +2 Will: +3, chaotic, Robe of the Faith, Scourge of the Maimed One, Darts of Pain.
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DM Cojo
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Re: Converting from 4e

Post by DM Cojo »

Thanks for the tips! I will have to take a good look at these modules and see about applying your advice. I will let you know if I have more questions.
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DM Marcus
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Re: Converting from 4e

Post by DM Marcus »

That's great advice Skyscraper. I know that 4E gets some grief from the old-school crowd, but our gang enjoyed playing it (and we still do some times). It has many great stream-lined innovations and is a breeze to DM.

If you have some old-school game master experience, you can use many of the smooth mechanics of 4E and still infuse old-school role play into the system.

What I started doing to shake things up was use the DCC mercurial magic tables, crits and fumbles tables and corruption results in our 4E game. It brought some crazy randomness to our overly-balanced 4E game.
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Re: Converting from 4e

Post by Harley Stroh »

Cojo!

Thanks for all your great emails to Spellburn.

Re: 4e. Which adventures did you get?

//H
The lucky guy who got to write some Dungeon Crawl Classics.

DCC Resource thread: character sheets, judge tools, and the world's fastest 0-level party creator.
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Raven_Crowking
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Re: Converting from 4e

Post by Raven_Crowking »

If Joseph is ever looking to make official conversions of 4e adventures, I am available.

:twisted:
SoBH pbp:

Cathbad the Meek (herbalist Wizard 1): AC 9; 4 hp; S 7, A 7, St 10, P 17, I 13, L 8; Neutral; Club, herbs, 50' rope, 50 cp; -1 to melee attack rolls. Hideous scar.
Harley Stroh
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Re: Converting from 4e

Post by Harley Stroh »

Hehehehehehehehe. You are a good man, Bishop.

//H
The lucky guy who got to write some Dungeon Crawl Classics.

DCC Resource thread: character sheets, judge tools, and the world's fastest 0-level party creator.
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Raven_Crowking
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Re: Converting from 4e

Post by Raven_Crowking »

I do my best.

Or my worst.

Or both.

:twisted:
SoBH pbp:

Cathbad the Meek (herbalist Wizard 1): AC 9; 4 hp; S 7, A 7, St 10, P 17, I 13, L 8; Neutral; Club, herbs, 50' rope, 50 cp; -1 to melee attack rolls. Hideous scar.
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DM Cojo
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Re: Converting from 4e

Post by DM Cojo »

Harley Stroh wrote:Cojo!

Thanks for all your great emails to Spellburn.

Re: 4e. Which adventures did you get?

//H
I got Sellswords of Punjar, The Vampire's Vengeance, Caves of the Crawling Lord, and Thrones of Punjar.

Since Sellswords is for level 1, I was thinking of converting that one for my group first. Do you have any tips on converting that specifically?
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