No Funnel Backgrounds
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- Oakbelly
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No Funnel Backgrounds
Starting a game without doing the funnel yet my players need backgrounds for their initial skill. What do you guys use or would use?
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- Bobjester
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Re: No Funnel Backgrounds
Rolling for occupations might work, but if your players have already chosen their race/class, then the occupation might not match.
“The wounds received in battle bestow honor, they do not take it away...”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
Re: No Funnel Backgrounds
Since skills are just background/roleplaying info in DCC (except for Thieves), can't you just have your players come up with their background story and hence their skills?
If that's a no-go, you could note that even when you create a level 1 character, you could still start out by rolling for occupation randomly, before you select your class. This way if a player chooses a class incongruous with his or her occupation, at least that was the choice of the player, and not something that feels forced upon you.
Alternatively, if they are used to thinking about skills in the form of which occupation that grants them, they could pick the occupation that best fits their vision for their character. Or just roll randomly for inspiration, not being forced to keep the result they rolled.
If that's a no-go, you could note that even when you create a level 1 character, you could still start out by rolling for occupation randomly, before you select your class. This way if a player chooses a class incongruous with his or her occupation, at least that was the choice of the player, and not something that feels forced upon you.
Alternatively, if they are used to thinking about skills in the form of which occupation that grants them, they could pick the occupation that best fits their vision for their character. Or just roll randomly for inspiration, not being forced to keep the result they rolled.
- GnomeBoy
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Re: No Funnel Backgrounds
I'm confused by the idea that an occupation that needs to match with a class... Occupation does not determine class, except for demihumans, by RAW. Occupations can't be wrong when matched with any of the four human classes.
Doctors can become actors, for example.Radical career changes happen in real life, so what's to stop a farmer or a butcher becoming a Cleric or a Thief, what's to say a mercenary can't become a Wizard or that an alchemist can't become a Warrior...?
Doctors can become actors, for example.Radical career changes happen in real life, so what's to stop a farmer or a butcher becoming a Cleric or a Thief, what's to say a mercenary can't become a Wizard or that an alchemist can't become a Warrior...?
...
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Gnome Boy • DCC playtester @ DDC 35 Feb '11. • Beta DL 2111, 7AM PT, 8 June 11.
Playing RPGs since '77 • Quasi-occasional member of the Legion of 8th-Level Fighters.
Link: Here Be 100+ DCC Monsters
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- Bobjester
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Re: No Funnel Backgrounds
If you roll a demi-human occupation, ignore the demi-human part and use the rest of the description.
“The wounds received in battle bestow honor, they do not take it away...”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
Re: No Funnel Backgrounds
We just roll them normally and run with it. Makes for interesting stuff like a halfling who used to be a cook in an elven town.
Re: No Funnel Backgrounds
I am sure you can see that SOME players will find it incongruous to find that their Warrior was a scribe or dancer in his previous life. Even if you don't yourself.
I think we can look at it in another way: since occupation means so very little (at least once you're 1st level), why not simply let players of this disposition
...roll two times and pick the best result? (or three times... or simply roll until they get a result they like?)
...simply choose the occupation they would like their hero to once have had?
...FIRST roll Occupation THEN choose Class?
or, indeed:
...just accept that your hero had this wholly random occupation once, and use the rules as written?
Meaning: I do see your point, GnomeBoy. But I also see the issue raised by Oakbelly. I hope that even if you don't share his concern, you are able to acknowledge that it CAN be a thing for some players.
===
My idea from earlier upthread (repeated here as "occupation before class") means that if you roll up a gong-farmer with 18 Int, it is still YOUR CHOICE to make him a Wizard. If the idea of a lowly muck-raker "suddenly" becoming a mighty spellcaster is so problematic for you, then you simply ignore the minmax class choice and make him something else - problem solved. And if you can't bring yourself to "wasting" that beautiful Int score on something other than a Wizard, then your issues with his previous occupation clearly were surmountable in the end - and again the problem is solved!
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Re: No Funnel Backgrounds
I assumed gnomeboy was confused because of my statement above. Whether the onus of confusion was on why occupation & class needs to match, or what, I simply pointed out that occupation & class might not match - without any judgement - simply an observation.
Say occupation random roll & chosen class do match - yay.
Say that they don't match - what will player & judge do then? This is left up to them, without any judgment. Will the player & judge come up with filler backstory to explain, or will they re-roll, or make another class choice altogether. That's up to them!
Really, all I thought of was that the occupation roll was already a part of character creation, why not use it, even though the game starts at 1st level, bypassing 0 level? My warning wasn't meant to dissuade any from using it because its not a perfect solution, and rolled results might not match the players' expectations.
There are always room to make adjustments.
“The wounds received in battle bestow honor, they do not take it away...”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
- GnomeBoy
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Re: No Funnel Backgrounds
I'm not quite sure how to reply, given the number of hypotheticals thrown out there... : }
I will say that Occupation has never meant only a "little" -- it's the basis of the skill set for each and every character. I lean into it when running games, probably every time. And that includes a campaign with 5th and 6th level characters.
And I always explain to new players that Occupation is where you started, your Class is where you are now. I guess we have a different mind-set on this, but I'm glad I'm not still sweeping up for a living (based on my first job!). Not that there's anything wrong with that, but 6 hours a week ain't gonna pay the rent!
I will say that Occupation has never meant only a "little" -- it's the basis of the skill set for each and every character. I lean into it when running games, probably every time. And that includes a campaign with 5th and 6th level characters.
And I always explain to new players that Occupation is where you started, your Class is where you are now. I guess we have a different mind-set on this, but I'm glad I'm not still sweeping up for a living (based on my first job!). Not that there's anything wrong with that, but 6 hours a week ain't gonna pay the rent!
...
Gnome Boy • DCC playtester @ DDC 35 Feb '11. • Beta DL 2111, 7AM PT, 8 June 11.
Playing RPGs since '77 • Quasi-occasional member of the Legion of 8th-Level Fighters.
Link: Here Be 100+ DCC Monsters
bygrinstow.com - The Home of Inner Ham
Gnome Boy • DCC playtester @ DDC 35 Feb '11. • Beta DL 2111, 7AM PT, 8 June 11.
Playing RPGs since '77 • Quasi-occasional member of the Legion of 8th-Level Fighters.
Link: Here Be 100+ DCC Monsters
bygrinstow.com - The Home of Inner Ham
Re: No Funnel Backgrounds
Well, for something that doesn't mean a "little", the rulebook sure makes it look like skills are inconsequential.
Hint: any major aspect of the game should *probably* be covered by more than just a page
DCC made the conscious choice to remove the formal skills of d20 (without replacing them with a new set of predetermined skills). That sends a message, whether Goodman Games want it to or not.
But that's neither here nor there. The point is, yes, I can empathize* with those that feel its incongruous for my learned wizard to suddenly spring into existence out of the lowly shell of a sheepherder or pitfighter.
To those I say, if you FIRST generate Occupation (just as the rules direct you to), it is then YOUR CHOICE:
* Choose Wizard for that juicy 18 Int and you clearly don't feel too bad about the jump from gongfarmer to wizard...
or
* Choose Warrior despite that juicy 18 Int because you feel that's the logical progression for a gongfarmer...
Either way the problem is solved, since you got to make the choice!
It is only if you first choose class, then retroactively apply an Occupation you might feel forced into a character concept you're not entirely comfortable with. So... don't do that then
*) I also completely understand those thinking random chargen needs to sometimes lead to... random outcomes, so whatever the results, it should be viewed as a role-playing challenge and motivator and something good, rather than something bad
Hint: any major aspect of the game should *probably* be covered by more than just a page
DCC made the conscious choice to remove the formal skills of d20 (without replacing them with a new set of predetermined skills). That sends a message, whether Goodman Games want it to or not.
But that's neither here nor there. The point is, yes, I can empathize* with those that feel its incongruous for my learned wizard to suddenly spring into existence out of the lowly shell of a sheepherder or pitfighter.
To those I say, if you FIRST generate Occupation (just as the rules direct you to), it is then YOUR CHOICE:
* Choose Wizard for that juicy 18 Int and you clearly don't feel too bad about the jump from gongfarmer to wizard...
or
* Choose Warrior despite that juicy 18 Int because you feel that's the logical progression for a gongfarmer...
Either way the problem is solved, since you got to make the choice!
It is only if you first choose class, then retroactively apply an Occupation you might feel forced into a character concept you're not entirely comfortable with. So... don't do that then
*) I also completely understand those thinking random chargen needs to sometimes lead to... random outcomes, so whatever the results, it should be viewed as a role-playing challenge and motivator and something good, rather than something bad
- Raven_Crowking
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Re: No Funnel Backgrounds
I believe this is another case where trying it might give you more insight.
SoBH pbp:
Cathbad the Meek (herbalist Wizard 1): AC 9; 4 hp; S 7, A 7, St 10, P 17, I 13, L 8; Neutral; Club, herbs, 50' rope, 50 cp; -1 to melee attack rolls. Hideous scar.
Cathbad the Meek (herbalist Wizard 1): AC 9; 4 hp; S 7, A 7, St 10, P 17, I 13, L 8; Neutral; Club, herbs, 50' rope, 50 cp; -1 to melee attack rolls. Hideous scar.